20°C / 22°C
  • Tue
  • 28°C
  • 14°C
  • Wed
  • 30°C
  • 14°C
  • Thu
  • 29°C
  • 15°C
  • Fri
  • 26°C
  • 15°C
  • Sat
  • 27°C
  • 14°C
  • Sun
  • 27°C
  • 14°C
  • Tue
  • 23°C
  • 16°C
  • Wed
  • 21°C
  • 14°C
  • Thu
  • 22°C
  • 14°C
  • Fri
  • 25°C
  • 15°C
  • Sat
  • 29°C
  • 16°C
  • Sun
  • 22°C
  • 15°C
  • Tue
  • 31°C
  • 17°C
  • Wed
  • 32°C
  • 16°C
  • Thu
  • 32°C
  • 17°C
  • Fri
  • 28°C
  • 18°C
  • Sat
  • 29°C
  • 16°C
  • Sun
  • 29°C
  • 16°C
  • Tue
  • 30°C
  • 13°C
  • Wed
  • 32°C
  • 15°C
  • Thu
  • 32°C
  • 13°C
  • Fri
  • 26°C
  • 16°C
  • Sat
  • 28°C
  • 15°C
  • Sun
  • 29°C
  • 15°C
  • Tue
  • 27°C
  • 22°C
  • Wed
  • 27°C
  • 22°C
  • Thu
  • 26°C
  • 21°C
  • Fri
  • 24°C
  • 20°C
  • Sat
  • 26°C
  • 21°C
  • Sun
  • 28°C
  • 22°C
  • Tue
  • 22°C
  • 18°C
  • Wed
  • 21°C
  • 17°C
  • Thu
  • 20°C
  • 15°C
  • Fri
  • 21°C
  • 14°C
  • Sat
  • 21°C
  • 16°C
  • Sun
  • 24°C
  • 17°C
  • Tue
  • 28°C
  • 17°C
  • Wed
  • 24°C
  • 13°C
  • Thu
  • 26°C
  • 11°C
  • Fri
  • 30°C
  • 14°C
  • Sat
  • 34°C
  • 17°C
  • Sun
  • 26°C
  • 16°C
  • Tue
  • 22°C
  • 17°C
  • Wed
  • 20°C
  • 13°C
  • Thu
  • 21°C
  • 13°C
  • Fri
  • 25°C
  • 15°C
  • Sat
  • 27°C
  • 17°C
  • Sun
  • 22°C
  • 16°C
  • Tue
  • 31°C
  • 16°C
  • Wed
  • 33°C
  • 16°C
  • Thu
  • 34°C
  • 16°C
  • Fri
  • 30°C
  • 18°C
  • Sat
  • 31°C
  • 18°C
  • Sun
  • 30°C
  • 18°C
  • Tue
  • 32°C
  • 15°C
  • Wed
  • 31°C
  • 16°C
  • Thu
  • 30°C
  • 13°C
  • Fri
  • 30°C
  • 15°C
  • Sat
  • 30°C
  • 17°C
  • Sun
  • 31°C
  • 16°C
  • Tue
  • 26°C
  • 16°C
  • Wed
  • 30°C
  • 16°C
  • Thu
  • 27°C
  • 17°C
  • Fri
  • 23°C
  • 16°C
  • Sat
  • 25°C
  • 15°C
  • Sun
  • 27°C
  • 17°C
  • Tue
  • 24°C
  • 17°C
  • Wed
  • 19°C
  • 15°C
  • Thu
  • 20°C
  • 14°C
  • Fri
  • 21°C
  • 13°C
  • Sat
  • 23°C
  • 14°C
  • Sun
  • 24°C
  • 17°C

LIVE BLOG: Mcebisi Jonas says many were afraid to testify at State Capture Inquiry

Former deputy minister of finance Mcebisi Jonas is being cross-examined at the Zondo commission by Duduzane Zuma legal representatives.

WATCH LIVE: Mcebisi Jonas returns to State Capture Inquiry hot seat for cross-examination:

Evidence relating to Denel will be dealt with on Monday.

This concludes the proceedings for today until Monday.

Chair Zondo thanks Jonas for availing himself.

Hlongwane's legal team did not make it today.

Fana Hlongwane's legal team will cross-examine Jonas

 Trengrove says Ntlemeza's appointment was set aside by the high court. Ends his testimony.

Trengrove reads from Duduzane Zuma's statement asserting the reported issue between Jonas and Hlongwane was not resolved. Jonas says there was no truth to that. Trengrove then moves on to the versions of two Gupta brothers.

Trengrove asks Jonas if Hlongwane and Duduzane raised the issue of rumours of blackmail. Jonas says the two did not ask about this and if they did he would have proved that they were not true.

Advocate Wim Trengrove, Jona's lawyer, will re-examine Jonas. He said it will take 10 minutes.

Jonas says it's nonsense that Fana Hlongwana tried to blackmail.

Jonas will be re-examined by another advocate

Zondo welcomes his decision.

Louw then asks to end his cross-examination now.

Louw says he would like more time but it will be the same issues.

Jonas says the statement was brought by General Mononope and he didn't sign it. He says the statement is false.

Jonas says the last discussion he had with Berning Ntlemeza was to say another person would be taking over his case.

Jonas says Ntlemeza's statement is incorrect. "A lie or incorrect?" Louw asks. Jonas maintains it's incorrect.

Jonas says looking at the call lists, those were not his numbers and the call duration suggests the conversations were very short.

Jonas says the numbers they tried to reach him on were incorrect. Jonas says there was a statement but no docket.

Louw looks at testimony from Berning Ntlemeza and the police...

Mcebisi Jonas says many people feared testifying at the commission. He adds that Fikile Mbalula was afraid of being ridiculed.

Jonas says the reality of the matter is that there are a lot of people in government who would see things but rather keep quiet.

I know that talking to Mbalula that he would be ridiculed. Jonas said.

"The situation at the time was so hostile. I didn't trust the police, the Hawks." Jonas responds.

"Why did you not lay a charge?" Louw asks

"How is it possible for a deputy minister to release a statement that has so many gross dependencies?" Adv Louw asks.

Adv Louw says Jonas' statement has inconsistencies. 

Louw: Did you ask Mr Zuma what the meeting was about?
Jonas: No, I didn't. 

Adv Louw asks Jonas why he left his bodyguards to go with Duduzane to an undisclosed venue at the time. 

Jonas says he didn't ask Duduzane Zuma what the meeting was about.

Adv Louw asks Jonas how long the meeting was at Saxonwold.
Jonas: Between 20 and 30 minutes.

Adv Louw insists that Jonas was going to meet Hlongwane but Jonas denies this. There is a back and fourth between the two.

Louw: Your attorney, knowingly sent out the wrong statement to the public protector?
Jonas says there were parts that were incorrect.

Adv Louw asks if he saw his statement before it was send to PP. Jonas says he had a chance to see the statement, but there was a rush to submit. 

Proceedings adjourn for tea break.

Adv Mokoena says Ajay Gupta he never offered him a ministerial position. To which Jonas says it's a lie. 

Jonas says he didn't confidence in law enforcement agencies.

Jonas is adamant that there was a Gupta brother throughout the meeting.

Fana Hlongwane. Picture: EWN.

Duduzane Zuma. Picture: EWN.

Ajay Gupta denied he threatened to kill Jonas, as Mokoena reads the statement.

Advocate Mokoena goes through Ajay Gupta's evidence

"I'm confident there was a Gupta brother in the room." Jonas is not backing down.

"That's not true, the Guptas were present throughout the meeting," Jonas maintains. 

Jonas says he would have said no because of their controversy in the media.

"If you were told that you were meeting at the Gupta residence, what would you have said?" Adv Mokoena asks Jonas.

"That's not true." Jonas sticking to his guns.

Jonas said he met Duduzane at the Hyatt in Rosebank then it moved to Saxonwold, the Gupta compound. He says he didn't know they were going to the Guptas' home.

Jonas says whatever friendship he had with Hlongwane ended after the meeting.

Jonas says he spoke to Fana Hlongwane once and they had no relationship after the meeting.

"That's untrue." Jonas keep saying.

Jonas maintains that one of the Gupta brothers was also part of his meeting with Duduzane Zuma.

Deputy Chief Justice Zondo asks Jonas to describe the details of his meeting with Duduzane Zuma.

"I didn't know Duduzane at all. The only time I knew him was when Mr Hlongwane told him Duduzane wanted a meeting with him." Jonas said.

Jonas says he never said Fana Hlongwane was blackmailing him.


Adv Mokoena now takes Jonas through the evidence of Hlongwane, Duduzane Zuma and some of the Gupta brothers.

"Intelligence was used to pursue some of the people," Jonas says.

He says he was ostracized in a palpable manner.

Jonas says the biggest mistake is thinking State Capture is about former president Jacob Zuma.

Advocate Mokoena asks Jonas to describe the kind of hostility he faced before he was fired.

Raymond Zondo now talks about the role of Parliament in state capture... "Is there something Parliament could have done?"

Jonas says the scrutiny towards National Treasury in the last decade began within government and later extended to party structures.

Jonas is now clarifying utterances he made last year that there was hostility towards the ministry of finance. He says hostility was directed to National Treasury and the minister. 

Jonas is being led to evidence by Advcate Phillip Mokoena.

All three men have rejected the allegations.

Jonas said he had met with former president Jacob Zuma's son Duduzane, businessman Fana Hlongwane and the eldest of the Gupta brothers, Ajay. 

Good morning and welcome to EWN's live blog about Mcebisi Jonas being back at the State Capture Inquiry to be cross-examined by the defence of some of the people he implicated in his testimony.